I will attend the big game if you can send me details I have loads of figs I can use if you need any + vehicles terrian (last valley) and grand manor buildings. pm me i'll give you my e-mail address. I have time now to work on my BCW (scotland) campaign a couple of weeks start up i need our internet guru do do a bit of tweaking with this forum before we get kicked off.
brian
Falkirk District Wargames Club.
FDWC Club Forum.
1938 A Very British Civil War
evesham
by nana Sahib » Tue May 12, 2009 8:55 am
Capt in the 4th japatti regt, Biryani Brigade 4th vindaloo division
The curry's on me
http://www.mutineerminiatures.com
The curry's on me
http://www.mutineerminiatures.com
-
nana Sahib - Posts: 1017
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 6:23 pm
- Location: Lucknow
by Hastings » Sun May 17, 2009 2:46 pm
The updated May 2009 version of state of the War - thanks for all the contributions keep them coming!
Scotland
Forces are growing in Aberdeen and the North East declaring for Prince Albert and presumably opening negotiations with the Anglican League.They are opposed by BUF/SUF Guerilla units led by George Barr-Gillie as well as Republican forces. Despite having one revolt already put down the 'Red' Clydeside workers and sailors council are again calling for the overthrow of the capitalist regime of the Republic and the formation of a communist state.In the South West another Fascist Guerilla unit led by the infamous 'Banker of Dalbeattie' hampers Border defence and assists English raiders. Fighting also around Fife and Falkirk . Clashes are reported between Miners, Anarchists and Republican Militia.
Border
Revival of Rieving along disputed lands of the Border with longstanding family fueds taking on the mantle of political factional conflict.
The Royalist Northern Army is also under presure from the Scots. Duke of Northumberland had to be rescued by BUF units after his plane was shot down and there has been fighting around Berwick on Tweed where the Scots have been aided by Miners militas.
'In the north Ashington, Ellington and Newbiggin have formed workers co-operative and are in the process of building coaling staithes at Newbiggin so they can export their coal without the using the Government controlled railways.
Further south in Chopwell a small mining village south of the Tyne, communism is rife and their message and fervour is spreading like a bushfire with other villages joining the cause. It is rumoured although not proven that they are obtaining arms from Liverpool and is in negotiations with Russia to obtain more modern weapons.
To the south of Chopwell is the West Durham Socialist Miners Party. They are a loose affiliation who aims to spread the word of socialism throughout the country.
The Earl of Durham, owner of the Lambton Estate, to counter the spread of Bolshevism and to protect his interests has raised a private army. He saw the writing on the wall after the Russian Revolution and bought a substantial amount of military surplus after the war which he now is putting to “good” use.
In the City of Newcastle the Anglican League have taken control of the city centre and have convinced the workers of Elwick in the west, Blue Star brewery in the north and Swan Hunters in the east to support them in their struggle to keep the city a true royalist stronghold.
Edward and Moseley recognised that there would be difficulties with local troops firing on their own friends and neighbours have deployed the King’s Own Tyneside Battalion in Fenham barracks in the north of Newcastle while across the river in Gateshead a battalion of BUF troops have been garrisoned. These troops have been brought in from the south of the county and can be trusted to obey orders.
Further north and to the west of the Great North Road the local wealthy landowners tired of paying the increased taxes have formed the Northumbrian Freedom Fighters. There started aim is for an independent Northumberland although many believe they are more concerned about their wallets. It hasn’t seemed to deter the locals as many have responded to the call spoiling for a fight with anyone.'
North East
York has declared against Edward but is not totally in line with the League.
Bradford Halifax and Huddersfield Communist and Anarchist groups in the ascendency
North Bradford(Baildon) Royalist/BUF area
Leeds Anti-Fascist but less left wing. Royal Ordinance factory held by royalist supporters
Sheffield strong in socialist Militas
East Coast
Lincoln is an Anglican centre and there are also Anglican forces gathering at Walsingham and Ely( including exiles from London). A large Anglican force from Ely has been spotted heading towards the so far "Neutral" town of Downham Market, Monarchist forces from Kings Lynn have been sent to help repel this aggressive action. Gt Yarmouth is a socialist free port, gathering a fleet of 'small ships'
Norwich under Royal control but left wing uprising very likely.
North of the county pro Royalist/BUF Gentlemen Farmers
North West
Liverpool under siege but managing to run supplies from north Wales and Cheshire as well as being supplied by sea. Lancashire pretty divided but like Liverpool under presure from BUF. BUF's main base in North West is Manchester. Cumbria and Westmoreland- majority Royalist. 'Bully Boy' Boyce has been appointed area BUF commander
East Midlands
Nottingham Socialists have been fighting fascist foreign volunteers around Grantham, Colwick and also at Newark .Losing control of the railways Govt forces are being forced to use the road network where some convoys have already been successfully ambushed. But generally East Midlands is a stalemate!!
West Midlands
'Despite being Mosley’s ‘2nd City’ after London, before the Civil War, Birmingham’s Fascists were largely outnumbered by the various Socialist factions within the city. The BUF had attempted to seize the city and surrounding towns, but after a series of bloody street battles had been ousted from the industrial heartland. The committee that was eventually established stopped short of declaring the area’s independence, but insisted that revolutionary government, along with church on Sunday, was essential if Birmingham was to shine as an example of British Socialism to the world. Birmingham Corporation was extended to cover the Coventry area (an unpopular posting for militia, as there was hard fighting to the east and south of the city with reactionary forces, being ‘sent to Coventry’ was usually a penalty of failure for some real or imagined lack of revolutionary conviction), and the ‘Black Country’ Towns to the West and North-West of the City. The Fascists had managed to maintain a hold on Wolverhampton and generally on the rural areas surrounding Birmingham. '
Severn Valley from Shrewsbury to Gloucester nominally under Royal control but frequent pockets of unrest. Anglican Cotswold Brigade made up of exiles from Gloucester and Worcester plus allies now joined up with Bishop of Hereford. Hereford also recieving some aid from Welsh nationalists. Warwickshire seems to be declaring for King
Wales itself the guerilla war is under way between more Royalist South and Nationalist north.Add to that the complications of a Welsh Fascist party that is at loggerheads with Mosley!
The South East .
The Fascist march on Canterbury ended in a bit of a shambles and the theoretical front line is on the Medway. However either side of the line there has been a fair ammount of skirmishing. But as we get to the first summer of the war Royalist-Fascist units seem to be mainly to the North and Leaugers to the South. Some having to abandon their home territories eg Bromley LDV and the Bank of England Rifles Anglican wise Arch Bishop of Canterbury is working on obtaining supplies and reinforcements for his colleagues.( a lot of French imports!) One plan maybe to open a route to rail convoys from Tonbridge (still in League hands) west meeting allied forces from Winchester and Salisbury before joining up with the forces of Bishop of Bath and Wells.Slight spanner in the works is that an army unit has taken over Winchester and the Bishop has disapeared. However same army unit has also seen off BUf so obviously not supporting EdwardBoth the Bishops of Exeter and Hereford are under a certain ammount of presure and there are probably not enough Anglican resources to support both
London
The Capital is still the base for the BUF and most likely Mosley's HQ. General Fielding (ex Staff college and military advisor to BUF) is probably with the King and Cirencester at Madresfield(nr Worcester) Meanwhile a force recruited from the Tyne has arrived in London to support BUF control over Hertfordshire
.
South
A BUF column fro Reading has captured Basingstoke from the Winchester Anglican League
The situation in Eastleigh and Southampton is confused as both League and more left wing groups try to control key assets.
Somerset
The Somerset Freedom Fighters are secure on Exmoor and the Quantoxs.
The B.U.F hold Taunton, Bridgewater and Weston-Super-Mare. But not all the land in between. BUF/Royalists control Bristol (for the most part) as far south as Bristol airport After the SFF victory at East Quantoxhead both the SFF and the Anglican League see Weston-Super-Mare with its airfield as the next target. The Anglican League are in Bath and Bradford on Avon. Also on the south side of the Mendips. Cheddar, Wells and Glastonbury are the main towns.There has also been fighting on the Mendips between the Anglican League and the North Somerset miners around Radstock and Midsomer Norton.
Devon
The Bishop of Exeter is trapped on the north Devon coast and Exeter is under siege by the Devon and Exeter Farmers Rifles
Cornwall
local warfare between Royalist and anti Royalist factions- Royalists having some support from Devon Military and anti Royalists have the backing of the DCLI
Stoke- - Derby- Leicester-. are still to declare their intentions
Scotland
Forces are growing in Aberdeen and the North East declaring for Prince Albert and presumably opening negotiations with the Anglican League.They are opposed by BUF/SUF Guerilla units led by George Barr-Gillie as well as Republican forces. Despite having one revolt already put down the 'Red' Clydeside workers and sailors council are again calling for the overthrow of the capitalist regime of the Republic and the formation of a communist state.In the South West another Fascist Guerilla unit led by the infamous 'Banker of Dalbeattie' hampers Border defence and assists English raiders. Fighting also around Fife and Falkirk . Clashes are reported between Miners, Anarchists and Republican Militia.
Border
Revival of Rieving along disputed lands of the Border with longstanding family fueds taking on the mantle of political factional conflict.
The Royalist Northern Army is also under presure from the Scots. Duke of Northumberland had to be rescued by BUF units after his plane was shot down and there has been fighting around Berwick on Tweed where the Scots have been aided by Miners militas.
'In the north Ashington, Ellington and Newbiggin have formed workers co-operative and are in the process of building coaling staithes at Newbiggin so they can export their coal without the using the Government controlled railways.
Further south in Chopwell a small mining village south of the Tyne, communism is rife and their message and fervour is spreading like a bushfire with other villages joining the cause. It is rumoured although not proven that they are obtaining arms from Liverpool and is in negotiations with Russia to obtain more modern weapons.
To the south of Chopwell is the West Durham Socialist Miners Party. They are a loose affiliation who aims to spread the word of socialism throughout the country.
The Earl of Durham, owner of the Lambton Estate, to counter the spread of Bolshevism and to protect his interests has raised a private army. He saw the writing on the wall after the Russian Revolution and bought a substantial amount of military surplus after the war which he now is putting to “good” use.
In the City of Newcastle the Anglican League have taken control of the city centre and have convinced the workers of Elwick in the west, Blue Star brewery in the north and Swan Hunters in the east to support them in their struggle to keep the city a true royalist stronghold.
Edward and Moseley recognised that there would be difficulties with local troops firing on their own friends and neighbours have deployed the King’s Own Tyneside Battalion in Fenham barracks in the north of Newcastle while across the river in Gateshead a battalion of BUF troops have been garrisoned. These troops have been brought in from the south of the county and can be trusted to obey orders.
Further north and to the west of the Great North Road the local wealthy landowners tired of paying the increased taxes have formed the Northumbrian Freedom Fighters. There started aim is for an independent Northumberland although many believe they are more concerned about their wallets. It hasn’t seemed to deter the locals as many have responded to the call spoiling for a fight with anyone.'
North East
York has declared against Edward but is not totally in line with the League.
Bradford Halifax and Huddersfield Communist and Anarchist groups in the ascendency
North Bradford(Baildon) Royalist/BUF area
Leeds Anti-Fascist but less left wing. Royal Ordinance factory held by royalist supporters
Sheffield strong in socialist Militas
East Coast
Lincoln is an Anglican centre and there are also Anglican forces gathering at Walsingham and Ely( including exiles from London). A large Anglican force from Ely has been spotted heading towards the so far "Neutral" town of Downham Market, Monarchist forces from Kings Lynn have been sent to help repel this aggressive action. Gt Yarmouth is a socialist free port, gathering a fleet of 'small ships'
Norwich under Royal control but left wing uprising very likely.
North of the county pro Royalist/BUF Gentlemen Farmers
North West
Liverpool under siege but managing to run supplies from north Wales and Cheshire as well as being supplied by sea. Lancashire pretty divided but like Liverpool under presure from BUF. BUF's main base in North West is Manchester. Cumbria and Westmoreland- majority Royalist. 'Bully Boy' Boyce has been appointed area BUF commander
East Midlands
Nottingham Socialists have been fighting fascist foreign volunteers around Grantham, Colwick and also at Newark .Losing control of the railways Govt forces are being forced to use the road network where some convoys have already been successfully ambushed. But generally East Midlands is a stalemate!!
West Midlands
'Despite being Mosley’s ‘2nd City’ after London, before the Civil War, Birmingham’s Fascists were largely outnumbered by the various Socialist factions within the city. The BUF had attempted to seize the city and surrounding towns, but after a series of bloody street battles had been ousted from the industrial heartland. The committee that was eventually established stopped short of declaring the area’s independence, but insisted that revolutionary government, along with church on Sunday, was essential if Birmingham was to shine as an example of British Socialism to the world. Birmingham Corporation was extended to cover the Coventry area (an unpopular posting for militia, as there was hard fighting to the east and south of the city with reactionary forces, being ‘sent to Coventry’ was usually a penalty of failure for some real or imagined lack of revolutionary conviction), and the ‘Black Country’ Towns to the West and North-West of the City. The Fascists had managed to maintain a hold on Wolverhampton and generally on the rural areas surrounding Birmingham. '
Severn Valley from Shrewsbury to Gloucester nominally under Royal control but frequent pockets of unrest. Anglican Cotswold Brigade made up of exiles from Gloucester and Worcester plus allies now joined up with Bishop of Hereford. Hereford also recieving some aid from Welsh nationalists. Warwickshire seems to be declaring for King
Wales itself the guerilla war is under way between more Royalist South and Nationalist north.Add to that the complications of a Welsh Fascist party that is at loggerheads with Mosley!
The South East .
The Fascist march on Canterbury ended in a bit of a shambles and the theoretical front line is on the Medway. However either side of the line there has been a fair ammount of skirmishing. But as we get to the first summer of the war Royalist-Fascist units seem to be mainly to the North and Leaugers to the South. Some having to abandon their home territories eg Bromley LDV and the Bank of England Rifles Anglican wise Arch Bishop of Canterbury is working on obtaining supplies and reinforcements for his colleagues.( a lot of French imports!) One plan maybe to open a route to rail convoys from Tonbridge (still in League hands) west meeting allied forces from Winchester and Salisbury before joining up with the forces of Bishop of Bath and Wells.Slight spanner in the works is that an army unit has taken over Winchester and the Bishop has disapeared. However same army unit has also seen off BUf so obviously not supporting EdwardBoth the Bishops of Exeter and Hereford are under a certain ammount of presure and there are probably not enough Anglican resources to support both
London
The Capital is still the base for the BUF and most likely Mosley's HQ. General Fielding (ex Staff college and military advisor to BUF) is probably with the King and Cirencester at Madresfield(nr Worcester) Meanwhile a force recruited from the Tyne has arrived in London to support BUF control over Hertfordshire
.
South
A BUF column fro Reading has captured Basingstoke from the Winchester Anglican League
The situation in Eastleigh and Southampton is confused as both League and more left wing groups try to control key assets.
Somerset
The Somerset Freedom Fighters are secure on Exmoor and the Quantoxs.
The B.U.F hold Taunton, Bridgewater and Weston-Super-Mare. But not all the land in between. BUF/Royalists control Bristol (for the most part) as far south as Bristol airport After the SFF victory at East Quantoxhead both the SFF and the Anglican League see Weston-Super-Mare with its airfield as the next target. The Anglican League are in Bath and Bradford on Avon. Also on the south side of the Mendips. Cheddar, Wells and Glastonbury are the main towns.There has also been fighting on the Mendips between the Anglican League and the North Somerset miners around Radstock and Midsomer Norton.
Devon
The Bishop of Exeter is trapped on the north Devon coast and Exeter is under siege by the Devon and Exeter Farmers Rifles
Cornwall
local warfare between Royalist and anti Royalist factions- Royalists having some support from Devon Military and anti Royalists have the backing of the DCLI
Stoke- - Derby- Leicester-. are still to declare their intentions
- Hastings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:36 pm
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by nana Sahib » Thu May 28, 2009 10:42 pm
Well here is the Whitburn BUF
this bloody camera is to good they look superb in the flesh and not to good on the pictures
this bloody camera is to good they look superb in the flesh and not to good on the pictures
Capt in the 4th japatti regt, Biryani Brigade 4th vindaloo division
The curry's on me
http://www.mutineerminiatures.com
The curry's on me
http://www.mutineerminiatures.com
-
nana Sahib - Posts: 1017
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 6:23 pm
- Location: Lucknow
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Captain Black » Fri May 29, 2009 2:24 pm
Very nice.When would you like another game at the club old boy 
SIG Spectrum IS Green
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Captain Black - Posts: 1445
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: Falkirk
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Hastings » Sun Jun 07, 2009 7:15 pm
The Big game at Evesham is starting to fill up we have 15 players so far including Admiral Togo and Colin from SESWC flying the flag for Scotland. ( I don't count being born south of the border and having to umpire!) Anymore volunteers most welcome.
- Hastings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:36 pm
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Hastings » Sat Jul 18, 2009 11:19 am
Ok these are the commands for the big game at Evesham 26/27th Sept -still same spaces if you get in quick.
Day 1
Shrewsbury
Anti Govt
Scots Commander Admiral Sir James Douglas- Buccleah
Sakura
Scots Commander Major David Pittscotie
Admiral Togo (Brian at Falkirk)
Liverpool Commander Major Edmond Hughes (ex Liverpool Regt) and Political Officer Archie Fenwick
Mr T
Govt
Northern army Commander Sir Thomas 'Hotspur' Percy
Reiverdance
Liverpool Front forces 'Bully Boy' Boyce
Roger C
Militas Commander Mayor of Shrewsbury Eric Peters
Evesham
Anti Government
Assault Column No1 Major Alex 'Spike' Robinson
Assault Column No2 Major Charlie Gibson
Birmingham Militia Commandant John McNelly
Govt
Commander Milita Reserve Commandant Wilfred Lynchcombe
George C.
Commander Garrison Villages Sir Horatio Naylor JP
Lowtardog
Commander Recce and forward op forces Rt Hon Captain Montagu Spires MP
Tewkesbury
Anti Govt
Kent Anglican League Rt Hon Major General R.T. Rowlins MP
Kevin USA
Southern Anglian League -Bishop of Bath and Wells
Mort
West Anglican League- Bishop of Hereford
Mike H
Government
Guards Commander The Duke of Montfort-
Big Martin
Militia Commander- Lord Cirencester
Genialjim
Militia Commander 2- The Earl of Glamorgan
Musketeer
Reserve Characters
Anglican League Captain Bertron Appleby-Smythe
Militas Acting Major Ernest Smallfellow
Peoples Assault Column Fred Yardley
Militas Commandant Emma Picton-Bryant
Anglican League Sir Cyril Stanley
BUF General A.A. (Arthur Alexander!!) Fielding
Day 1
Shrewsbury
Anti Govt
Scots Commander Admiral Sir James Douglas- Buccleah
Sakura
Scots Commander Major David Pittscotie
Admiral Togo (Brian at Falkirk)
Liverpool Commander Major Edmond Hughes (ex Liverpool Regt) and Political Officer Archie Fenwick
Mr T
Govt
Northern army Commander Sir Thomas 'Hotspur' Percy
Reiverdance
Liverpool Front forces 'Bully Boy' Boyce
Roger C
Militas Commander Mayor of Shrewsbury Eric Peters
Evesham
Anti Government
Assault Column No1 Major Alex 'Spike' Robinson
Assault Column No2 Major Charlie Gibson
Birmingham Militia Commandant John McNelly
Govt
Commander Milita Reserve Commandant Wilfred Lynchcombe
George C.
Commander Garrison Villages Sir Horatio Naylor JP
Lowtardog
Commander Recce and forward op forces Rt Hon Captain Montagu Spires MP
Tewkesbury
Anti Govt
Kent Anglican League Rt Hon Major General R.T. Rowlins MP
Kevin USA
Southern Anglian League -Bishop of Bath and Wells
Mort
West Anglican League- Bishop of Hereford
Mike H
Government
Guards Commander The Duke of Montfort-
Big Martin
Militia Commander- Lord Cirencester
Genialjim
Militia Commander 2- The Earl of Glamorgan
Musketeer
Reserve Characters
Anglican League Captain Bertron Appleby-Smythe
Militas Acting Major Ernest Smallfellow
Peoples Assault Column Fred Yardley
Militas Commandant Emma Picton-Bryant
Anglican League Sir Cyril Stanley
BUF General A.A. (Arthur Alexander!!) Fielding
- Hastings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:36 pm
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by nana Sahib » Sun Jul 19, 2009 3:55 pm
looking forward to it do I need to bring any figures i have loads to choose from
Capt in the 4th japatti regt, Biryani Brigade 4th vindaloo division
The curry's on me
http://www.mutineerminiatures.com
The curry's on me
http://www.mutineerminiatures.com
-
nana Sahib - Posts: 1017
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 6:23 pm
- Location: Lucknow
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Hastings » Sun Jul 19, 2009 10:07 pm
Great Admiral!
If you can email list of what you have , ill let you know what i'd like you to bring.
Solwayminiatures@aol.com
Have got sorted for Band B? There are some links on the GWP site
If you can email list of what you have , ill let you know what i'd like you to bring.
Solwayminiatures@aol.com
Have got sorted for Band B? There are some links on the GWP site
- Hastings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:36 pm
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Hastings » Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:06 pm
Just to let you chaps know the second 1938 book is now out and available from the Solway website
http://solwaycraftsandminiatures.webs.com/
http://solwaycraftsandminiatures.webs.com/
- Hastings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:36 pm
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Captain Black » Fri Dec 18, 2009 6:45 pm
Anyone know were i can find information on British army units stationed in Scotland between 1936 and 1939 and there garrison tonws.
SIG Spectrum IS Green
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Captain Black - Posts: 1445
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: Falkirk
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by thomastmcc » Fri Dec 18, 2009 8:51 pm
Captain Black wrote:Anyone know were i can find information on British army units stationed in Scotland between 1936 and 1939 and there garrison tonws.
kenny my TO&Es group mate..
owner of the yahoo group for WW1 ,WW2 and Modern TO&Es
(Tables of organisation & equipment or Unit of action )
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/TOandEs/
(Tables of organisation & equipment or Unit of action )
http://games.groups.yahoo.com/group/TOandEs/
-
thomastmcc - Posts: 567
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 4:28 pm
- Location: falkirk
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Hastings » Sat Dec 19, 2009 5:30 pm
Kenny
Been quite a bit posted on GWP too latest is this
http://gwargamesp.18.forumer.com/index.php?showtopic=1893
Been quite a bit posted on GWP too latest is this
http://gwargamesp.18.forumer.com/index.php?showtopic=1893
- Hastings
- Posts: 54
- Joined: Mon Dec 15, 2008 6:36 pm
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Captain Black » Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:50 pm
Thanks for that info men 
SIG Spectrum IS Green
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Captain Black - Posts: 1445
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: Falkirk
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Captain Black » Thu Feb 04, 2010 7:12 pm
I have put a post about the BCW on the campaigns page on the forum that mite interest some of you's
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Captain Black - Posts: 1445
- Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:30 pm
- Location: Falkirk
Re: 1938 A Very British Civil War
by Jed HR » Tue Feb 16, 2010 12:19 am
Just thought you should know that four members of the "British Occupation Force" stationed at Leuchars will be attending the VBCW bash at Lundin Links Hotel on Saturday 20th Feb!
Hope to see some of your gang there?
Otherwise, I know only of Colin Jack from SESWC and Brian Cunniffe from Angus who will be going.
Cheers
Jed H-R
Hope to see some of your gang there?
Otherwise, I know only of Colin Jack from SESWC and Brian Cunniffe from Angus who will be going.
Cheers
Jed H-R
-
Jed HR - Posts: 51
- Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2007 7:59 pm
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